7.3 missing File Browser ??

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7.3 missing File Browser ??

W4RH4WK
hello everyone,

today i downloaded the current source code from google-code,
configured it, compiled it... everything works fine but "vim ."
doesn't launch the file browser, it just opens vim and tells me ". is
a Directory"

configure-command: ./configure --prefix=/usr --with-features=huge
using Ubuntu 10.10

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Re: 7.3 missing File Browser ??

lainme
Did you check all the directories installed?

If you can't find netrw in anywhere, you can download it from the vim script website

On Sat, Nov 6, 2010 at 4:32 PM, W4RH4WK <[hidden email]> wrote:
hello everyone,

today i downloaded the current source code from google-code,
configured it, compiled it... everything works fine but "vim ."
doesn't launch the file browser, it just opens vim and tells me ". is
a Directory"

configure-command: ./configure --prefix=/usr --with-features=huge
using Ubuntu 10.10

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Re: 7.3 missing File Browser ??

W4RH4WK
$ cd Desktop/vim
$ find | grep netrw
./.hg/store/data/runtime/syntax/netrwlist.vim.i
./.hg/store/data/runtime/syntax/netrw.vim.i
./.hg/store/data/runtime/doc/pi__netrw.txt.d
./.hg/store/data/runtime/doc/pi__netrw.txt.i
./.hg/store/data/runtime/plugin/_netrw_settings.vim.i
./.hg/store/data/runtime/plugin/_netrw_file_handlers.vim.i
./.hg/store/data/runtime/plugin/netrw.vim.i
./.hg/store/data/runtime/plugin/netrw_settings.vim.i
./.hg/store/data/runtime/plugin/_netrw_plugin.vim.i
./.hg/store/data/runtime/plugin/netrw_plugin.vim.i
./.hg/store/data/runtime/autoload/netrw.vim.d
./.hg/store/data/runtime/autoload/netrw.vim.i
./.hg/store/data/runtime/autoload/netrw_file_handlers.vim.i
./.hg/store/data/runtime/autoload/netrw_settings.vim.i
./runtime/syntax/netrw.vim
./runtime/doc/pi_netrw.txt
./runtime/plugin/netrwPlugin.vim
./runtime/autoload/netrwFileHandlers.vim
./runtime/autoload/netrw.vim
./runtime/autoload/netrwSettings.vim

don't know if thats alright, but it looks like netrw is present,
or am i mistaken?

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Re: 7.3 missing File Browser ??

Benjamin R. Haskell-8
On Sat, 6 Nov 2010, W4RH4WK wrote:

> $ cd Desktop/vim
> $ find | grep netrw
> ./.hg/store/data/runtime/syntax/netrwlist.vim.i
> ./.hg/store/data/runtime/syntax/netrw.vim.i
> ./.hg/store/data/runtime/doc/pi__netrw.txt.d
> ./.hg/store/data/runtime/doc/pi__netrw.txt.i
> ./.hg/store/data/runtime/plugin/_netrw_settings.vim.i
> ./.hg/store/data/runtime/plugin/_netrw_file_handlers.vim.i
> ./.hg/store/data/runtime/plugin/netrw.vim.i
> ./.hg/store/data/runtime/plugin/netrw_settings.vim.i
> ./.hg/store/data/runtime/plugin/_netrw_plugin.vim.i
> ./.hg/store/data/runtime/plugin/netrw_plugin.vim.i
> ./.hg/store/data/runtime/autoload/netrw.vim.d
> ./.hg/store/data/runtime/autoload/netrw.vim.i
> ./.hg/store/data/runtime/autoload/netrw_file_handlers.vim.i
> ./.hg/store/data/runtime/autoload/netrw_settings.vim.i
> ./runtime/syntax/netrw.vim
> ./runtime/doc/pi_netrw.txt
> ./runtime/plugin/netrwPlugin.vim
> ./runtime/autoload/netrwFileHandlers.vim
> ./runtime/autoload/netrw.vim
> ./runtime/autoload/netrwSettings.vim
>
> don't know if thats alright, but it looks like netrw is present, or am
> i mistaken?

It shows that netrw is present in the source directory.  After building
Vim `./configure ; make`, you should install it into a different
directory via `make install`.  If you're not doing that, you should;
most build tools aren't written to support installation into the source
directory.  If I try running `vim` from the source directory without the
`make install` step, it can't find its runtime files (because it's
looking for them in the directory where they'd be installed).  And it
comes back with the same "is a directory" error.

If you did run the `make install` step, check instead where Vim was
installed, not your source directory.

--
Best,
Ben

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Re: 7.3 missing File Browser ??

Nikolay Aleksandrovich Pavlov
Reply to message «Re: 7.3 missing File Browser ??»,
sent 19:15:40 06 November 2010, Saturday
by Benjamin R. Haskell:

> It shows that netrw is present in the source directory.  After building
> Vim `./configure ; make`, you should install it into a different
> directory via `make install`.  If you're not doing that, you should;
> most build tools aren't written to support installation into the source
> directory.  If I try running `vim` from the source directory without the
> `make install` step, it can't find its runtime files (because it's
> looking for them in the directory where they'd be installed).  And it
> comes back with the same "is a directory" error.
>
> If you did run the `make install` step, check instead where Vim was
> installed, not your source directory.
I do not install vim anywhere and everything works fine. In order to have it
working without installing anywhere I set up an alias:
  alias VimBeta="VIMRUNTIME=$HOME/tmp/vim/vim/runtime $HOME/tmp/vim/vim/src/vim"
Mercurial vim repository was cloned into $HOME/tmp/vim/vim and everything works
fine, so do not listen these people.

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Re: 7.3 missing File Browser ??

W4RH4WK
i first tried out that alias
alias VimBeta="VIMRUNTIME=$HOME/Desktop/vim/runtime $HOME/Desktop/vim/
src/vim"
would that be in my case...
$ VimBeta .
still not working (just opens vim and tells me "." is a directory

i also tried to do a "sudo make install" doesn't change anything
ether..

i just found out something more.. did a --version on my compiled vim
binary and the original one from the ubuntu repo
first the original:
$ /etc/alternatives/vim --version | grep brow
+arabic +autocmd +balloon_eval +browse ++builtin_terms +byte_offset
+cindent

now the self compiled
$ vim --version | grep brow
-arabic +autocmd -balloon_eval -browse +builtin_terms +byte_offset
+cindent

browse is in active in mine.. might that be the file browser? if so,
how can i enable it (i already did --with-features=huge)

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Re: 7.3 missing File Browser ??

Bee-16
On Nov 6, 12:54 pm, W4RH4WK <[hidden email]> wrote:

> i just found out something more.. did a --version on my compiled vim
> binary and the original one from the ubuntu repo
> first the original:
> $ /etc/alternatives/vim --version | grep brow
> +arabic +autocmd +balloon_eval +browse ++builtin_terms +byte_offset
> +cindent
>
> now the self compiled
> $ vim --version | grep brow
> -arabic +autocmd -balloon_eval -browse +builtin_terms +byte_offset
> +cindent
>
> browse is in active in mine.. might that be the file browser? if so,
> how can i enable it (i already did --with-features=huge)

"vim ." works fine here, a "Normal" version also with "-browse":

# vim --version | grep brow
-arabic +autocmd -balloon_eval -browse +builtin_terms +byte_offset
+cindent
# vim --version
VIM - Vi IMproved 7.3 (2010 Aug 15, compiled Nov  1 2010 20:37:54)
MacOS X (unix) version
Included patches: 1-47
Compiled by user@domain
Normal version without GUI.  Features included (+) or not (-):

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Re: 7.3 missing File Browser ??

Bee-16
On Nov 6, 10:03 pm, Bee <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Nov 6, 12:54 pm, W4RH4WK <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > i just found out something more.. did a --version on my compiled vim
> > binary and the original one from the ubuntu repo
> > first the original:
> > $ /etc/alternatives/vim --version | grep brow
> > +arabic +autocmd +balloon_eval +browse ++builtin_terms +byte_offset
> > +cindent
>
> > now the self compiled
> > $ vim --version | grep brow
> > -arabic +autocmd -balloon_eval -browse +builtin_terms +byte_offset
> > +cindent
>
> > browse is in active in mine.. might that be the file browser? if so,
> > how can i enable it (i already did --with-features=huge)
>
> "vim ." works fine here, a "Normal" version also with "-browse":
>
> # vim --version | grep brow
> -arabic +autocmd -balloon_eval -browse +builtin_terms +byte_offset
> +cindent
> # vim --version
> VIM - Vi IMproved 7.3 (2010 Aug 15, compiled Nov  1 2010 20:37:54)
> MacOS X (unix) version
> Included patches: 1-47
> Compiled by user@domain
> Normal version without GUI.  Features included (+) or not (-):

I should qualify "works fine". If I do:

"vim ." vim opens a Netrw Directory Listing of the current directory
and in the status area: "." is a directory

"vim /" vim opens a Netrw Directory Listing of the current directory
and in the status area: "/" Illegal file name

Do you get a Netrw Directory Listing?

-Bill

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Re: 7.3 missing File Browser ??

Bee-16
On Nov 6, 10:15 pm, Bee <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Nov 6, 10:03 pm, Bee <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > On Nov 6, 12:54 pm, W4RH4WK <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > > i just found out something more.. did a --version on my compiled vim
> > > binary and the original one from the ubuntu repo
> > > first the original:
> > > $ /etc/alternatives/vim --version | grep brow
> > > +arabic +autocmd +balloon_eval +browse ++builtin_terms +byte_offset
> > > +cindent
>
> > > now the self compiled
> > > $ vim --version | grep brow
> > > -arabic +autocmd -balloon_eval -browse +builtin_terms +byte_offset
> > > +cindent
>
> > > browse is in active in mine.. might that be the file browser? if so,
> > > how can i enable it (i already did --with-features=huge)
>
> > "vim ." works fine here, a "Normal" version also with "-browse":
>
> > # vim --version | grep brow
> > -arabic +autocmd -balloon_eval -browse +builtin_terms +byte_offset
> > +cindent
> > # vim --version
> > VIM - Vi IMproved 7.3 (2010 Aug 15, compiled Nov  1 2010 20:37:54)
> > MacOS X (unix) version
> > Included patches: 1-47
> > Compiled by user@domain
> > Normal version without GUI.  Features included (+) or not (-):
>
> I should qualify "works fine". If I do:
>
> "vim ." vim opens a Netrw Directory Listing of the current directory
> and in the status area: "." is a directory
>
> "vim /" vim opens a Netrw Directory Listing of the root directory
> and in the status area: "/" Illegal file name
>
> Do you get a Netrw Directory Listing?
>
> -Bill

Forgot to change "current directory" to "root directory" in the
previous comment.

If you open with only "vim" and then do ":E" (note uppercase "E") do
you get a Netrw Directory Listing?

--and--

Just for comparison here is my full --version:

# vim --version
VIM - Vi IMproved 7.3 (2010 Aug 15, compiled Nov  1 2010 20:37:54)
MacOS X (unix) version
Included patches: 1-47
Compiled by user@domain
Normal version without GUI.  Features included (+) or not (-):
-arabic +autocmd -balloon_eval -browse +builtin_terms +byte_offset
+cindent
-clientserver +clipboard +cmdline_compl +cmdline_hist +cmdline_info
+comments
-conceal +cryptv -cscope +cursorbind +cursorshape +dialog_con +diff
+digraphs
-dnd -ebcdic -emacs_tags +eval +ex_extra +extra_search -farsi
+file_in_path
+find_in_path +float +folding -footer +fork() -gettext -hangul_input
+iconv
+insert_expand +jumplist -keymap -langmap +libcall +linebreak
+lispindent
+listcmds +localmap -lua +menu +mksession +modify_fname +mouse -
mouseshape
-mouse_dec -mouse_gpm -mouse_jsbterm -mouse_netterm -mouse_sysmouse
+mouse_xterm +multi_byte +multi_lang -mzscheme +netbeans_intg -
osfiletype
+path_extra -perl +persistent_undo +postscript +printer -profile -
python
-python3 +quickfix +reltime -rightleft -ruby +scrollbind +signs
+smartindent
-sniff +startuptime +statusline -sun_workshop +syntax +tag_binary
+tag_old_static -tag_any_white -tcl +terminfo +termresponse
+textobjects +title
 -toolbar +user_commands +vertsplit +virtualedit +visual +visualextra
+viminfo
+vreplace +wildignore +wildmenu +windows +writebackup -X11 -xfontset -
xim -xsmp
 -xterm_clipboard -xterm_save
   system vimrc file: "/opt/local/etc/vimrc"
     user vimrc file: "$HOME/.vimrc"
      user exrc file: "$HOME/.exrc"
  fall-back for $VIM: "/opt/local/share/vim"
Compilation: /usr/bin/gcc-4.0 -c -I. -Iproto -DHAVE_CONFIG_H   -I/opt/
local/include -DMACOS_X_UNIX -no-cpp-precomp  -pipe -O -arch ppc -
D_FORTIFY_SOURCE=1
Linking: /usr/bin/gcc-4.0   -L/opt/local/lib -arch ppc -L/usr/local/
lib -o vim       -lm  -lncurses -liconv -framework Cocoa

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Re: 7.3 missing File Browser ??

Bee-16
On Nov 6, 10:25 pm, Bee <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Nov 6, 10:15 pm, Bee <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > On Nov 6, 10:03 pm, Bee <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > > On Nov 6, 12:54 pm, W4RH4WK <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > > > i just found out something more.. did a --version on my compiled vim
> > > > binary and the original one from the ubuntu repo
> > > > first the original:
> > > > $ /etc/alternatives/vim --version | grep brow
> > > > +arabic +autocmd +balloon_eval +browse ++builtin_terms +byte_offset
> > > > +cindent
>
> > > > now the self compiled
> > > > $ vim --version | grep brow
> > > > -arabic +autocmd -balloon_eval -browse +builtin_terms +byte_offset
> > > > +cindent
>
> > > > browse is in active in mine.. might that be the file browser? if so,
> > > > how can i enable it (i already did --with-features=huge)
>
> > > "vim ." works fine here, a "Normal" version also with "-browse":
>
> > > # vim --version | grep brow
> > > -arabic +autocmd -balloon_eval -browse +builtin_terms +byte_offset
> > > +cindent
> > > # vim --version
> > > VIM - Vi IMproved 7.3 (2010 Aug 15, compiled Nov  1 2010 20:37:54)
> > > MacOS X (unix) version
> > > Included patches: 1-47
> > > Compiled by user@domain
> > > Normal version without GUI.  Features included (+) or not (-):
>
> > I should qualify "works fine". If I do:
>
> > "vim ." vim opens a Netrw Directory Listing of the current directory
> > and in the status area: "." is a directory
>
> > "vim /" vim opens a Netrw Directory Listing of the root directory
> > and in the status area: "/" Illegal file name
>
> > Do you get a Netrw Directory Listing?
>
> > -Bill
>
> Forgot to change "current directory" to "root directory" in the
> previous comment.
>
> If you open with only "vim" and then do ":E" (note uppercase "E") do
> you get a Netrw Directory Listing?
>
> --and--
>
> Just for comparison here is my full --version:
>
> # vim --version
> VIM - Vi IMproved 7.3 (2010 Aug 15, compiled Nov  1 2010 20:37:54)
> MacOS X (unix) version
> Included patches: 1-47
> Compiled by user@domain
> Normal version without GUI.  Features included (+) or not (-):
> -arabic +autocmd -balloon_eval -browse +builtin_terms +byte_offset
> +cindent
> -clientserver +clipboard +cmdline_compl +cmdline_hist +cmdline_info
> +comments
> -conceal +cryptv -cscope +cursorbind +cursorshape +dialog_con +diff
> +digraphs
> -dnd -ebcdic -emacs_tags +eval +ex_extra +extra_search -farsi
> +file_in_path
> +find_in_path +float +folding -footer +fork() -gettext -hangul_input
> +iconv
> +insert_expand +jumplist -keymap -langmap +libcall +linebreak
> +lispindent
> +listcmds +localmap -lua +menu +mksession +modify_fname +mouse -
> mouseshape
> -mouse_dec -mouse_gpm -mouse_jsbterm -mouse_netterm -mouse_sysmouse
> +mouse_xterm +multi_byte +multi_lang -mzscheme +netbeans_intg -
> osfiletype
> +path_extra -perl +persistent_undo +postscript +printer -profile -
> python
> -python3 +quickfix +reltime -rightleft -ruby +scrollbind +signs
> +smartindent
> -sniff +startuptime +statusline -sun_workshop +syntax +tag_binary
> +tag_old_static -tag_any_white -tcl +terminfo +termresponse
> +textobjects +title
>  -toolbar +user_commands +vertsplit +virtualedit +visual +visualextra
> +viminfo
> +vreplace +wildignore +wildmenu +windows +writebackup -X11 -xfontset -
> xim -xsmp
>  -xterm_clipboard -xterm_save
>    system vimrc file: "/opt/local/etc/vimrc"
>      user vimrc file: "$HOME/.vimrc"
>       user exrc file: "$HOME/.exrc"
>   fall-back for $VIM: "/opt/local/share/vim"
> Compilation: /usr/bin/gcc-4.0 -c -I. -Iproto -DHAVE_CONFIG_H   -I/opt/
> local/include -DMACOS_X_UNIX -no-cpp-precomp  -pipe -O -arch ppc -
> D_FORTIFY_SOURCE=1
> Linking: /usr/bin/gcc-4.0   -L/opt/local/lib -arch ppc -L/usr/local/
> lib -o vim       -lm  -lncurses -liconv -framework Cocoa

From within vim what is the output of:
:echo $VIM
:echo $VIMRUNTIME

Compare the path with what you got when you did previously:
$ cd Desktop/vim
$ find | grep netrw

-Bill

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Re: 7.3 missing File Browser ??

W4RH4WK
i just removed everything vim specific from my system so i can start
over from nothing.
$ hg clone https://vim.googlecode.com/hg/ vim
i re downloaded the source and did
$ cd vim
$ ./configure
$ make
$ sudo make install
no errors occurred.

$vim .    no directory listing
:e .        no directory listing ("." is a directory)
:e /        no directory listing ("/" Illegal file name)
:E          no directory listing (E492: Not an editor command: E)

:echo $VIM
/usr/bin/vim
:echo $VIMRUNTIME
/usr/share/vim/vim73/

$ vim --version
VIM - Vi IMproved 7.3 (2010 Aug 15, compiled Nov  7 2010 10:20:50)
Included patches: 1-50
Compiled by w4rh4wk@fenix
Normal version without GUI.  Features included (+) or not (-):
-arabic +autocmd -balloon_eval -browse +builtin_terms +byte_offset
+cindent
-clientserver -clipboard +cmdline_compl +cmdline_hist +cmdline_info
+comments
-conceal +cryptv -cscope +cursorbind +cursorshape +dialog_con +diff
+digraphs
-dnd -ebcdic -emacs_tags +eval +ex_extra +extra_search -farsi
+file_in_path
+find_in_path +float +folding -footer +fork() +gettext -hangul_input -
iconv
+insert_expand +jumplist -keymap -langmap +libcall +linebreak
+lispindent
+listcmds +localmap -lua +menu +mksession +modify_fname +mouse -
mouseshape
-mouse_dec -mouse_gpm -mouse_jsbterm -mouse_netterm -mouse_sysmouse
+mouse_xterm -multi_byte +multi_lang -mzscheme +netbeans_intg -
osfiletype
+path_extra -perl +persistent_undo +postscript +printer -profile -
python
-python3 +quickfix +reltime -rightleft -ruby +scrollbind +signs
+smartindent
-sniff +startuptime +statusline -sun_workshop +syntax +tag_binary
+tag_old_static -tag_any_white -tcl +terminfo +termresponse
+textobjects +title
 -toolbar +user_commands +vertsplit +virtualedit +visual +visualextra
+viminfo
+vreplace +wildignore +wildmenu +windows +writebackup -X11 -xfontset -
xim -xsmp
 -xterm_clipboard -xterm_save
   system vimrc file: "$VIM/vimrc"
     user vimrc file: "$HOME/.vimrc"
      user exrc file: "$HOME/.exrc"
  fall-back for $VIM: "/usr/local/share/vim"
Compilation:
gcc -c -I. -Iproto -DHAVE_CONFIG_H     -g -O2 -D_FORTIFY_SOURCE=1
Linking: gcc   -L/usr/local/lib -Wl,--as-needed -o vim    -lSM -lICE
-lm -lncurses -lnsl

$ find | grep netrw
./.hg/store/data/runtime/syntax/netrwlist.vim.i
./.hg/store/data/runtime/syntax/netrw.vim.i
./.hg/store/data/runtime/doc/pi__netrw.txt.d
./.hg/store/data/runtime/doc/pi__netrw.txt.i
./.hg/store/data/runtime/plugin/_netrw_settings.vim.i
./.hg/store/data/runtime/plugin/_netrw_file_handlers.vim.i
./.hg/store/data/runtime/plugin/netrw.vim.i
./.hg/store/data/runtime/plugin/netrw_settings.vim.i
./.hg/store/data/runtime/plugin/_netrw_plugin.vim.i
./.hg/store/data/runtime/plugin/netrw_plugin.vim.i
./.hg/store/data/runtime/autoload/netrw.vim.d
./.hg/store/data/runtime/autoload/netrw.vim.i
./.hg/store/data/runtime/autoload/netrw_file_handlers.vim.i
./.hg/store/data/runtime/autoload/netrw_settings.vim.i
./runtime/syntax/netrw.vim
./runtime/doc/pi_netrw.txt
./runtime/plugin/netrwPlugin.vim
./runtime/autoload/netrwFileHandlers.vim
./runtime/autoload/netrw.vim
./runtime/autoload/netrwSettings.vim

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Re: 7.3 missing File Browser ??

W4RH4WK
i think i just solved it.. problem was something related to the vimrc
file...
i removed the on in /etc/ and copied the example vimrc file to my home
folder named .vimrc
now the file browser works (:E works too)

thanks for the help everyone

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Re: 7.3 missing File Browser ??

Benjamin R. Haskell-8
In reply to this post by Nikolay Aleksandrovich Pavlov
On Sat, 6 Nov 2010, ZyX wrote:

> Reply to message «Re: 7.3 missing File Browser ??»,
> sent 19:15:40 06 November 2010, Saturday
> by Benjamin R. Haskell:
>
>> It shows that netrw is present in the source directory.  After
>> building Vim `./configure ; make`, you should install it into a
>> different directory via `make install`.  If you're not doing that,
>> you should; most build tools aren't written to support installation
>> into the source directory.  If I try running `vim` from the source
>> directory without the `make install` step, it can't find its runtime
>> files (because it's looking for them in the directory where they'd be
>> installed).  And it comes back with the same "is a directory" error.
>>
>> If you did run the `make install` step, check instead where Vim was
>> installed, not your source directory.
> I do not install vim anywhere and everything works fine. In order to
> have it working without installing anywhere I set up an alias:
>  alias VimBeta="VIMRUNTIME=$HOME/tmp/vim/vim/runtime $HOME/tmp/vim/vim/src/vim"
> Mercurial vim repository was cloned into $HOME/tmp/vim/vim and
> everything works fine, so do not listen these people.

Just because you *can* do that doesn't mean you should.  This is bad
advice, especially if you want to do any development on Vim.  It's bad
for the same reason modifying files under VIMRUNTIME is bad: there are
cleaner mechanisms for making local customizations.  And it's bad from a
development standpoint because you end up with modified files in the
source directory that the version control system doesn't know *should*
be modified.  Both of these can cause problems when you update your
source files (unless you immediately rebuild).

In general, version control systems (in this case Mercurial) and build
systems (in this case autotools) aren't set up to cleanly handle the
case where source, build, and installation directories are the same.

Much better is to simply specify a prefix argument when you run
`configure`, e.g.:

./configure --prefix=$HOME/myvim --whatever-other-features

If you specify a directory to which you can write files, you don't need
root privileges for `make install`.

Also, I'm not saying this is some horrible, forbidden thing for you
(ZyX) to do.  You obviously know what you're doing, based on your list
posts here and in vim-dev.  I'm just pointing out that it's a bad thing
to suggest in general, because it adds another layer of complexity to
the checkout/build/install process.

--
Best,
Ben

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Re: 7.3 missing File Browser ??

Nikolay Aleksandrovich Pavlov
Reply to message «Re: 7.3 missing File Browser ??»,
sent 22:06:51 07 November 2010, Sunday
by Benjamin R. Haskell:

> Just because you *can* do that doesn't mean you should.  This is bad
> advice, especially if you want to do any development on Vim.  It's bad
> for the same reason modifying files under VIMRUNTIME is bad: there are
> cleaner mechanisms for making local customizations.  And it's bad from a
> development standpoint because you end up with modified files in the
> source directory that the version control system doesn't know *should*
> be modified.  Both of these can cause problems when you update your
> source files (unless you immediately rebuild).
Where have you seen modified files in source directory? I do not modify anything
in $VIMRUNTIME, I just do not install vim anywhere. If you are talking about
files that are generated by `make', then there are two points: 1) make does not
modify any tracked files (configure does); 2) you cannot install vim without
building it while inside a repository.

> In general, version control systems (in this case Mercurial) and build
> systems (in this case autotools) aren't set up to cleanly handle the
> case where source, build, and installation directories are the same.
You do not need any setup, you just should not track new files. .hgignore in vim
repository already has lines that handle it.

> Much better is to simply specify a prefix argument when you run
> `configure`, e.g.:
>
> ./configure --prefix=$HOME/myvim --whatever-other-features
It is not better because it affects only make install. But before you install
you must build it. And, surprise, configure will modify src/auto/config.mk which
is tracked.

> If you specify a directory to which you can write files, you don't need
> root privileges for `make install`.
I know.

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Re: 7.3 missing File Browser ??

Benjamin R. Haskell-8
On Sun, 7 Nov 2010, ZyX wrote:

> Reply to message «Re: 7.3 missing File Browser ??»,
> sent 22:06:51 07 November 2010, Sunday
> by Benjamin R. Haskell:
>
>> Just because you *can* do that doesn't mean you should.  This is bad
>> advice, especially if you want to do any development on Vim.  It's
>> bad for the same reason modifying files under VIMRUNTIME is bad:
>> there are cleaner mechanisms for making local customizations.  And
>> it's bad from a development standpoint because you end up with
>> modified files in the source directory that the version control
>> system doesn't know *should* be modified.  Both of these can cause
>> problems when you update your source files (unless you immediately
>> rebuild).
> Where have you seen modified files in source directory?

Hmm.  After `configure`, src/auto/config.mk.  But after `make`, nothing
in Vim.  Must have been thinking of another project.  It's still better
advice generally to install after building, rather than running software
out of the source directory.  Vim does a better job than most,
apparently.


> I do not modify anything in $VIMRUNTIME,

I didn't say you did.  I just said building and running out of the
source dir is bad for the same reasons.  And when $VIMRUNTIME is the
source dir, it's easier to modify things within $VIMRUNTIME for
development purposes, which is bad.


> I just do not install vim anywhere.

Right, and I'm saying one should, in general.


> If you are talking about files that are generated by `make', then
> there are two points: 1) make does not modify any tracked files
> (configure does);

Conceded above.  I work on a lot of projects, and Vim's better than many
in that regard.  It's also better about confining its files to the
--prefix=DIR directory.


> 2) you cannot install vim without building it while
> inside a repository.

You certainly can.  The first step of the build script I use sets up a
build directory:

builddir=`mktemp -d /tmp/build-vim.XXXXXXXX`
# Mercurial:
hg archive -t tar -p . - | (cd $builddir ; tar -xf -)
# Git: (I do most dev under an hg-git clone)
git archive HEAD | (cd $builddir ; tar -xf -)


>> In general, version control systems (in this case Mercurial) and
>> build systems (in this case autotools) aren't set up to cleanly
>> handle the case where source, build, and installation directories are
>> the same.
> You do not need any setup, you just should not track new files.
> .hgignore in vim repository already has lines that handle it.

What would you call .hgignore if it's not 'setup'?


>> Much better is to simply specify a prefix argument when you run
>> `configure`, e.g.:
>>
>> ./configure --prefix=$HOME/myvim --whatever-other-features
> It is not better because it affects only make install. But before you
> install you must build it. And, surprise, configure will modify
> src/auto/config.mk which is tracked.

I still assert that's broken (that src/auto/config.mk [a tracked file]
is modified, instead of a new file being created).


>> If you specify a directory to which you can write files, you don't
>> need root privileges for `make install`.
> I know.

I didn't say you didn't.  That was a general response.  (The OP wrote
that he had run `sudo make install`)

Best practices while developing code involve configuring and building,
and then installing to a directory other than the source directory.  (I
still assert that an external directory for configure+build is
preferable, but do what you will -- .hgignore is apparently set up to
mitigate this issue except for src/auto/config.mk).  Installing to a
directory other than the source directory allows changes to be made
within the source directory without affecting the installed version.
"Changes within the source directory" includes updating to the latest
code and changing things in the source directory for development
purposes.

--
Best,
Ben

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Re: 7.3 missing File Browser ??

Nikolay Aleksandrovich Pavlov
Reply to message «Re: 7.3 missing File Browser ??»,
sent 23:19:50 07 November 2010, Sunday
by Benjamin R. Haskell:

> Hmm.  After `configure`, src/auto/config.mk.  But after `make`, nothing
> in Vim.  Must have been thinking of another project.  It's still better
> advice generally to install after building, rather than running software
> out of the source directory.  Vim does a better job than most,
> apparently.
Generally I agree, though it requires additional copy. When talking about vim -
not.

> I didn't say you did.  I just said building and running out of the
> source dir is bad for the same reasons.  And when $VIMRUNTIME is the
> source dir, it's easier to modify things within $VIMRUNTIME for
> development purposes, which is bad.
Here I do not agree: if file is modified for development purposes it is better
to keep it tracked, so having source dir as $VIMRUNTIME will enable clearer
setup for testing.

> You certainly can.  The first step of the build script I use sets up a
> build directory:
>
> builddir=`mktemp -d /tmp/build-vim.XXXXXXXX`
> # Mercurial:
> hg archive -t tar -p . - | (cd $builddir ; tar -xf -)
> # Git: (I do most dev under an hg-git clone)
> git archive HEAD | (cd $builddir ; tar -xf -)
Forgot about this. You can optimize the process: mercurial can archive to
directory without using tar:
    hg archive $builddir
According to the ``git help archive'', git cannot do this.

> > You do not need any setup, you just should not track new files.
> > .hgignore in vim repository already has lines that handle it.
> What would you call .hgignore if it's not 'setup'?
If make does not modify tracked files, you do not need any setup. If vim did not
have .hgignore, the only thing you would need to do is to ignore additional
lines in `hg status'. It has - so it is good.

> Best practices while developing code involve configuring and building,
> and then installing to a directory other than the source directory.  (I
> still assert that an external directory for configure+build is
> preferable, but do what you will -- .hgignore is apparently set up to
> mitigate this issue except for src/auto/config.mk).  Installing to a
> directory other than the source directory allows changes to be made
> within the source directory without affecting the installed version.
> "Changes within the source directory" includes updating to the latest
> code and changing things in the source directory for development
> purposes.
If I need to ignore changes to the source directory and still install software
from SCM, I write an ebuild and let cave handle it (it is possible to create a
package without being system administrator if you want to do so). Otherwise I do
want this changes to affect currently used version.

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