All mails lost

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All mails lost

Mathias Michaelis
Dear developers

My emails are systematically filtered out. I can't even unsubscribe (why be on a list where own, very carefully composed contributions aren't desired?). I already have phoned to my ISP, and he's innocent. Now I am really helpless. If this email reaches the list, I will once more try to logout myself.

Best regards
Mathias

Webmail TcNet GmbH http://www.tcnet.ch


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Re: All mails lost

Matthew Winn
On Wed, Jun 07, 2006 at 11:33:09AM +0200, Mathias Michaelis wrote:
> My emails are systematically filtered out. I can't even unsubscribe
> (why be on a list where own, very carefully composed contributions
> aren't desired?). I already have phoned to my ISP, and he's innocent.

I'm seeing your messages on the list.  There have been situations in the
past where the list has silently discarded messages because they don't
match some arbitrary unpublished criterion, but that doesn't appear to
be the case here.

[cc'd to poster to be certain the message gets through]

--
Matthew Winn ([hidden email])
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Re: All mails lost

Mathias Michaelis
Hello Matthew, dear developers

>> My emails are systematically filtered out.
>>
> I'm seeing your messages on the list.
>
First: Thanks for replying so fast!

But: You don't see no of my mails written yesterday, and also not
all from this morning. The testmail written at 09:03:28 +0200 is not
from me, but from my Email-Provider. I found that emails that are
written on my Thunderbird Email Client AND where addressed to
[hidden email] or an address to unsubscribe from the list where
filtered away, BUT emails written on the web interface of my ISP
reached the list.

I can verify that on the mail archive

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vimdev

Although I have unsubscribed my self, I yet receive emails from the
list and - suddenly - I can send emails again to the list. Very curious!

> There have been situations in the past where the list has
> silently discarded messages because they don't match some
> arbitrary unpublished criterion, but that doesn't appear to be
> the case here.
>
First I thought emails must not be written on Thunderbird, but that
apparently isn't true any more.

> [cc'd to poster to be certain the message gets through]
>
Thanks again for your reply!

Best regards

Mathias
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Re: All mails lost

A.J.Mechelynck
Mathias Michaelis wrote:
[...]
> But: You don't see no of my mails written yesterday, and also not
> all from this morning. The testmail written at 09:03:28 +0200 is not
> from me, but from my Email-Provider. I found that emails that are
> written on my Thunderbird Email Client AND where addressed to
> [hidden email] or an address to unsubscribe from the list where
> filtered away, BUT emails written on the web interface of my ISP
> reached the list.
>  
[...]

There may be an explanation to that: Thunderbird writes its mail in HTML
by default, and the vim-list robot silently discards all HTML mail as an
anti-spam measure. I use Thunderbird myself with no problems, even when
writing to the Vim lists, but whenever I compose an email, I click
Options -> Format -> Plain Text Only. (As a side-effect, this makes the
toolbar disappear from below the "Subject" line, since fonts, bold,
italic, etc., are for HTML only.)


HTH,
Tony.
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Re: All mails lost

iler.ml
In reply to this post by Mathias Michaelis
On 6/7/06, Mathias Michaelis <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >> My emails are systematically filtered out.

Find the 'plaintext' option in your Thunderbird client, and
use it when you send to mailing list.

I thought mailinglist filter was supposed to bounce
back to you the html-formatted message in case
this was the reason it ignored the message.

In case the filter found your message spam-like or
virus-like (always a possibility, depending on your writing style :-)
, I think the filter might or might not indicate back to you
why it discarded the message.

If you're already experimenting with testmessages to the list,
you potentially *could* (I mean, police would not stop you)
do this:
1) send html-formatted "test, please ignore" message to the
list and see what happens
2) *caution, violent material ahead* take copy of some
spam message you received in the past, and send it
(plaintext!) to the list with subject "test, please ignore"
and see what happens. If you never received spam messages
in the past, try this 1 liner: "Buy <v-word here> cheap."

At this point, I'm starting to doubt whether this message
of mine is going to make it into the list ......

Hope this helps.
Yakov

P.S. The moral is: although you cannot know
what happened in one single case, you can seek parameters
and experiment to find connection between parameters and
outcome.
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Re: All mails lost

Mathias Michaelis
In reply to this post by Mathias Michaelis
Tony

> > I found that emails that are written on my Thunderbird Email
> > Client AND where addressed to [hidden email] ... were filtered
> > away, ...
> >
> There may be an explanation to that: Thunderbird writes its mail in HTML
> by default, ...
>
Thanks for reply -- I appreciate that also those nasty problems are
discussed seriously. But anyway: I don't write HTML emails, I turn this
(un-)feature off where ever it is possible. So this explanation can be excluded.

Sincerely

Mathias

Webmail TcNet GmbH http://www.tcnet.ch


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Re: All mails lost

iler.ml
On 6/7/06, Mathias Michaelis <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Thanks for reply -- I appreciate that also those nasty problems are
> discussed seriously. But anyway: I don't write HTML emails, I turn this
> (un-)feature off where ever it is possible. So this explanation can be excluded.

Thinking about it again, I remember vaguely that I had at least 1 case
when list ignored my message. What I did, I re-sent it next day and it got
into the list. The truth is, email is not 100% reliable, neither is
mailing list software.

I do get outgoing email loss every now and then. Part of life. "Just re-send
it next day" is my empirical rule that seems to work me.

Not to talk about this case several months back when mailing list was
totally dead for 3 days. Now, think about it, if mailing list can ignore
all messages for 3 days, do you have a proof it can't ignore some
random single message ? That's why re-sending helps.

Yakov
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Re: All mails lost

Mathias Michaelis
Yakov

> ... That's why re-sending helps.
>
Thanks again! Yes, I experienced that once or twice too. But this
time, waiting one night didn't help, so I thought it stays like that
for ever: I am receiving mails, can't reply nor unsubscribe nor
influence in any way what's going on. This is why I was a little bit
in panic.

Excuse me!
Sincerely
Mathias